Neal Morse: "With Mike Portnoy, we were each other’s saving grace"

If you are a Neal Morse fan, one thing is certain: you won’t run out new music. After 30 years of making great music with Spock's Beard, Transatlantic, Flying Colors, his solo band, NMB and several other projects, Neal seems to have no intention of either stopping or even slowing down the pace at which he produces music. But most importantly, almost everything he does varies from really good to spectacularly good...

In my opinion, his latest work, "No Hill For A Climber", an album released under the moniker of Neal Morse And & Resonance, belongs to the latter category. Combining the spectacular, trademark progressive rock songwriting skills of Neal with some fresh ideas brought by a group of young musicians from Nashville, the result is just wonderful.

I had the chance to talk with Neal about the making of the album, his collaboration with guys from Resonance and their input on the final result, and his future plans now that Mike Portnoy has returned to Dream Theater.

Hello Neal!

Hey, how are you?

I'm fine. And how are you?

I'm good!

You look nice there, on the outside…

Yeah, I'm out on the porch with my two dogs here, so I'm happy!

I have my own dog here in the apartment. Not outside, but it's still OK.

Good!

First of all, it's always a pleasure and a privilege to have the chance to talk with you. I haven lost count. It must be around the 9th or 10th time in the last 15 years. So it's always a pleasure for me to have the chance to talk with you.

Oh, well, thank you. Appreciate that. Likewise.

Being big fan for over 25 years, I think we'll cover some ground again today of all these years and specifically for your new album that we are doing this interview for. But, to be honest, although I always try to pay close attention to what you're doing and what you're up to all the time, I kind of lost attention and I thought that the second "Joseph" album that you put out in early 2024 would was going to be the only album that would come out this year. But then, who can tell when your creativity arrives? So, I was really happy to see that you're releasing a new album and this time it's a different one as you work with the new band. So please let me know the story of how this album with The Resonance came about.

Well, I was looking at 2024 from 2023. In the fall of 2023 I was thinking "well, what am I going to do in 2024?". You know, the "Joseph" album had long since been delivered. And I knew we were doing MorseFest in January and Cruise To The Edge in March with Flying Colors, but I didn't have any plan after that. And I was like "man, I need to make some plans to record, but who with?". You know, with Mike being back in Dream Theater that kind of puts all of those bands on hold for the moment, because he's really focused on that, which is good and appropriate.

So, I was talking about it with my wife, probably in December. And she suggested doing something with these talented local younger musicians. And I thought "well, we can try it. Let's pray about it". And so I did. And I got together with them in January. If you saw the "All The Rage" video, January 26th, that was when we first got together just to play and jam and see what would happen. And I could tell right away, right after, it was like a first date, I guess you'd say. And I could tell right away that there was some magic there. There was some good feeling. So we got together one more time.

Anyway, that was how it all started. And then obviously it grew. By February, I was pretty sure that I wanted to do it, so I was making the deal with Inside Out. And then we got together again maybe once or twice in March, but then we really got together to make the album in April. So we made the album in April, put the finishing touches on it at the beginning of May and delivered it to Rich Mouser to be mixed about mid-May. And then he worked on it until… I don't think we delivered it till the end of June. I think he worked on it for a whole long time… (laughs)

Yeah. But anyway, I'm very-very happy with how it turned out.

Yeah, at least it didn't take quite long because these days some albums tend to take much time from when they were made to when they're released. There seems to be a big gap, but this seems to be still quite fresh, so that's good.

Yeah, yeah, it's hard to wait. You know, when you're excited about something, you want everybody to hear it, but you have to wait. And then, by the time people like you are listening to it… Well, I finished my parts on it in May, and then I started working on this other album with Chester Thompson, and that's what I've been working on all summer. So, my head's in a totally different place now. You know, I have to think back through your question what was going on with that. But it's just the way it is. It's part of the process.

So, how did it feel for you to work with a team of younger guys? You know, I was thinking that as newcomers in the prog realm, I'm sure that musically they look up to you. And they look to you like a role model or something. So how was it like you to have this young guys around you?

You know, it didn't feel like that…

OK!

Well, I didn't feel like that… I was definitely on like… some of those guys I'm like almost twice their age or something, you know? Philip Martin is 22, I think. He's really young, the drummer. So, I don't know…

But, we know each other a long time and I think he knows I respect him and I think he respects me. I was definitely the producer, so I was leading, I had the saying for everything. And I wrote more material, so it was sort of half… it was still kind of a Neal Moore solo album, but also with them. So, that's why I thought it was appropriate to call it Neal Morse And The Resonance.

Yeah, yeah…

It wouldn't have fit at all just to call it a Neal Morse album. But, it really wasn't quite a full band either. I still did a lot more stuff… (laughs) But that's normal. I always wind up doing a lot of stuff on the albums that I work on.

But, what's cool with NMB is like, on the last NMB album I let Bill and Eric do all of their parts first before I did anything. So, I did a lot less on that album, because everything was already pretty filled in. I only did stuff if I heard something I can add or something that was needed. That was a pretty different experience working with the young guys as opposed to like NMB. With the guys in NMB for the most part we write the album in the room and then Mike does his drums and then we all leave and everybody does their parts at their home studios. So, everybody's really producing themselves.

With this album I was definitely I was definitely more of a hands on producer. There was some stuff that was done by others. Andre (Matadian) did some guitars at his place and Chris Riley did a few things in his place, but most of the stuff that you hear on that album was done here at my studio, with me there. We were together more, because we live local and that's a really cool thing and procedure.

Like I remember in the middle of the album, at the "Thief" song, I got stuck. I was working on it and I just didn't know where to go with it. And so I called up Chris Riley and said "hey man, what are you doing? You want to come over and work on this piece with me?" and he's like "Sure!". And he just came over and he provided the middle whole section that was missing and then that just made it all come together, man.

Nice!

Sometimes it's you need that piece and then you find the magic!

Yeah. Overall, what was the main contribution of the other guys in the final outcome? Was it bits and pieces like this one? Or were there any more major contributions? What was their input in the album?

Well, I mean… Obviously, they played on a lot of the stuff. So as far as their playing goes, it just has Phillip’s flavor instead of what Mike would have done or what Nick would have done on the drums. Or what Eric would have done on guitar? Andre is just his own artist…

And as far as the writing goes, we wrote some of the stuff in the room, mostly "No Hill For A Climber" was written in the room. Although Chris Riley wrote that whole middle section and that whole "Burn it down" section. He felt inspired. Right around the time of the making of this album, he felt like God gave him that piece. And I felt that way about other things, too. So it's hard to say… You know, even though we weren't always together writing it was because we were doing this and all our minds we're thinking about this album. Then Chris came in with this song and then I came in with this song, but it was all part of that this album was happening in the way that it was. I mean, even though I may have written "All The Rage" by myself, I was thinking of that. And that influenced the way that it was written

OK, I get it. Then of course I have to say that "No Hill For A Climber" is another astonishing album in a long catalog of astonishing albums that you've put out through the years…

Oh, thank you!

So, of course, congrats for it! Then, even though you’re so prolific, you still manage to make such inspired music. And, I always say, "OK, it's gonna be just another Neal album. How good can it be this time again?" And then you deliver something so good. I don't know how you do it.

Well, thank you. I'm glad you feel that way!

I mean, I love creating and writing music. It’s one of my very favorite things to do. And I get to do it a lot! So I'm really thankful that I continue to be inspired and I continue to wake up in the morning with ideas I think might be cool… or not to be cool. And then you bring other people into it and we all start mixing up our ideas, and it turns into something nice.

Somehow, I think this album turned out like a nice balance between your established musical identity, if I might say so, you know the kind of prog that we know and adore from you, but with some new stuff here and there that provide a fresh air. Like maybe the jazzy parts of "Thief" or some melodies that turned out different. Do you feel it too? Do you think that there is a continuity and at the same time some new stuff on this album for you?

Yeah. There are several things, particularly in "Thief".. that hip hop groove, I didn't write it that way. I didn't conceive of being like that. And then Joe Ganzelli had the idea for that drum groove and that really changed everything. Another thing that's different in "Thief", a lot of times if there’s an intense, proggy middle section I want it to peak and then stop and then go into back into the beginning… [sings the fading in of "Thief"]. I knew I wanted to do that, but I was like "what can I do?". What can we do to peak this thing out? And for the first time ever, I said, rather than write some really fast things… [Neal is singing like he’s playing some really fast notes]… I mean, that would be the other option. Maybe if it had been NMB that might have been what we had would have done, which I'm sure would be really cool. But I just decided "what if everybody all of a sudden just starts freaking out?". Like everybody just starts… [Neal starts singing some crazy musical parts]. And so Philip and I actually improvised that "freak out" moment. I think I was playing bass and he was playing drums and so that part started with just bass and drums, just freaking out and then I knew I wanted it to stop… [Neal sings how music pauses and gets back into Theif]… (laughs) And I think that's really different. I've never done anything like that.

Interesting and nice! Another thing that I was thinking is that you have a song like "All The Rage", that you mentioned earlier that you wrote yourself. And it's another fine example of how you can manage to meld prog music and catchiness in one. You've done it so many times before. I can think of so many of your songs that at the same time are proggy and catchy… you know poppy and prog. Like, "Mask Machine" or "Day For Night" and so forth… Is there a fine art in keeping this balance? I think these songs are quite important in your catalog in general, because they get the attention of a new listener and then they push him to swim in deep prog waters later on…

Right! Yeah, yeah.

I think that's something that distinguishes you from other prog musicians that you can make a prog song and make it so sounds so catchy. Is there an art behind it or it just occurs to you?

Well, I think people are usually trying to write and create stuff that's like the stuff that they always really liked. I mean, most people do that. If they like Taylor Swift, they're trying to write stuff that's like them, but maybe it'll be in the vein of Taylor Swift.

Most of the progressive rock that I like almost always had or has a chorus that you can sing along to. Like "The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway"… Most of the times there’s a chorus to the songs that I really like. in the same way I grew up listening to The Beatles… I think what you're talking about is that there's these proggy elements, but then there's a chorus that's maybe is a little simpler that you can sing along to. And I like that.

I remember the first time I listened to The Flower Kings. Someone had a cassette of their first record and I remember of course "We believe in love"... [Neal sings the melody]. That was really great and I was like "oh, wow", because most of the progressive rock that I would get sent had a lot of really good fast playing or had really good instrumentals, but you didn't hear a really good chorus very often. And so I always like to have those. Even in the epics you want to have a chorus that comes back around. "It's a great adventure of my life" [Neal sings the chorus from the "The Great Adventure]. That's an important thing in music in general. Even in classical music, my favorite are the ones that have a melody that I can sing along and hum and remember, like "Ode To Joy" or even "Ride Of The Valkyrie"… [Neal sings the melody]. I always try to write that kind of stuff because that's what I like.

But, it’s not that easy to achieve. It doesn't always flow. I’ve heard bands that have tried to combine prog and pop, but it feels like it's uneven. I don't know if I'm explaining that correctly. It needs it a balance. It needs the proggy parts and the technical stuff to be inspired and flow into the catchy chorus and then come back and make it interesting. Otherwise, it seems like you're just putting together pieces that are kind of unbalanced, if I may say…

Yeah, it is hard. Balance is important. And uh, I don't know if I've always achieved it, but I try…. (laughs)

I can tell you that you have, I think that you're that you have mastered the art, I may say, so I.

Well, thank you!

Now, are you thinking of this collaboration with The Resonance as full band? Like take it on the road to support the album. Or maybe you'd prefer to maybe write another album first, collect more material and see how this works out and see if that entity has the, the potential to go out and tour? How do you think about that?

Well, I'm not thinking about it. We haven't even talked about it. As soon as that album got released, then I dove into this Chester Thompson album, which I'm still working on. And I need to work on MorseFest. Like I need to finish it!

And when the smoke clears, maybe we'll talk about it. But right now I'm just waiting for the album to come out and see what happens. So yeah, we don't have any plans currently, but who knows? Maybe we will…

Alright, now I'll take you to another subject. As a big fan of your music for almost 25 years, with any band that you've worked with, I wanted to know how you feel with the way things have involved. I mean, Transatlantic's future is uncertain to say the least. Flying Colors are kind of limited due to various reasons, with Casey and Steve and all that stuff. Meanwhile Eric is also having a new band now Temic, and of course, above all, Mike is back in Dream Theater which kind of affects all of the above, as well as The Neal Morse Band. So have you had any discussions about the future of these bands or you'll wait to see how things involve? What's the status with each one of them?

Well, nobody wants to do anything without Mike. So, everything's on hold. We haven't really talked about it. It's just sort of understood in Flying Colors. And Transatlantic was already going to be taking a break anyway. So, we haven't talked about it in Transatlantic.

We’ve talked about with NMB. We had some zoom calls last January for MorseFest. So we talked about it too. And everybody’s like "hey, man, we're all just wishing him the best and we understand that he needs to do his thing and he just needs to be focused on that right now". So they're all on hold. So, I felt to do other things this year and I'm really excited about these new projects, man, it's cool.

Now, about your relationship with Mike, allow me to say that I remember the day the news broke out there that he was going to leave Dream Theater around 15 years ago. But to be honest with you, I didn't worry that much about it. And the reason was basically because he had you on his side. I think that musically you were like his saving grace in a way...

Hmm… Oh well, that's very kind. We've made a lot of great music together, he and I. And I very appreciate that. You know, I think we've been each other saving grace… (laughs)

I know what I'm talking about. Because I'm pretty sure that your spirituality was also part that helped him go through things. And of course, yeah, your musical chemistry. Cause you've provided some of the greatest prog music of the last 20-25 years? And actually in the late 90s, it was Mike and Dream Theater that led me to Spock’s Beard and everything evolved from there.

Alright, cool.

So my wish is that you keep on working together, one way or another. And to keep making great music...

Yeah. Well, I would wish for that myself. Thank you!

So, another thing and I know that this might also sound somehow strange, but… with Mike going back in Dream Theater and all that stuff kind of falling back into place… I had a thought. What about you doing something with Spock’s Beard again? You still collaborate with Nick and you've worked with Ted more than he has with Spock’s Beard in the last few years. And, of course, Alan, Ryo and Dave are there. I'd love to see you paying tribute to history and the great music you've made, and maybe doing something new. Would you consider that?

Well, I would consider it. Sure! I mean… I don't know. I'm somebody, as you know, that I live my life generally by what I feel from the Lord to do. I would pray about that and feel that out. So, I don't know… I wouldn't really be that interested in turning back the clock. I'd want to do something new and interesting. But, there's not any love lost between any of us. We still care for one another. And maybe if the time was right, that would be a possibility.

So, getting back to what you’re up to now, are you pumped for the upcoming MorseFest?

Yes, very. We're doing both "Joseph" albums all the way through with all those great musicians and singers. Eric Gillette will be playing drums. Nick D’ Virgillio is also going to play. With Nick and Ted and Ross. And who am I forgetting? Wonderful people! Bill Hubauer, Randy George... It's going to be great talented people with all these great singers and players. Yeah, it's going to be two really-really special days.

Yeah, I'm. I haven't had the chance to witness in person a MorseFest, but I always buy all these deluxe editions and I always dig the videos of the DVDs. They're always special. It's really an effort that's worth keep doing if you can.

I'm glad you received that stuff so well! That's great.

Well, I don't know if there will be any chance to see you again in Greece. We'll be more than happy to have you again here. Otherwise, I'll try to come and see you again somewhere around Europe, cause it's been a while…

Come to London for the MorseFest. It's going to be great!

Well, I’d love to! Hope I can do it…